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Insight on Supply Problems, Larger Hard Drive and Movies on Xbox 360

The biggest issue that I've had with the idea if paying for downloading movies rentals via the Xbox Live Marketplace is that they are competing with "gray market" p2p sources of digital movies such as BitTorrent. That and the fact that I don't have enough space left on my 20 gig Xbox 360 hard drive and I get a lot of movies off Netflix. But Microsoft's biggest competition for digital movie distribution on Xbox Live is not Sony but BitTorrent.

I have had a theory is that the rise of popularity of sharing Divx and MP4 format movies via P2P networks was one of the reasons why Microsoft added playback support of both Divx and MP4 on the Xbox 360. They wanted to make sure that the Hollywood source is covered movies is covered on the Xbox 360 and the "gray" market P2P sources is also covered. If there was no demand for people wanting to play these formats they wouldn't spend the software engineering resources in making sure they worked on the 360 and the main source for people wanting to play these formats was getting movies from "gray" sources. On one hand Microsoft has deals with Hollywood to sell expensive rental movies with DRM (Digital Restriction Management) that expires in a day and on the other hand they support playback of video files that include the most popular formats on "gray" market video file distribution for those folks that know how to run p2p software and have the bandwidth. They wanted to tap into the demand that users had to play that content and they didn't want them using other systems and to keep them using Xbox 360. They didn't want for there to be a Divx/mp4 gap with the Playstation 3 and to loose customers because they were not supporting those popular but "gray" market video file formats.

That one of my favorite little Xbox conspiracies.

One of my sources on Xbox technical issues Xboxfounder has posted some interesting insightful comments about the supply issue problems, larger hard drives and a possible digital movie strategy on the Xbox 360. I've added some help for the abbreviations.

Xboxfounder writes:

360 capacity at Flextronics and Celestica (Manufacturing partners in Asia ) is 180k units per week. What did they sell last month, 230k? That's less than 1.5 weeks worth of production. If they have the capacity, and no quality or supply chain problems, they surely would have air shipped to meet demand. At this stage of the game, that's a given. Also, who lowers price when they can't meet demand? Or is the shortage just in NA (North America), not EU where the price was cut?

"I have to wonder what the real reasons are that they couldn't ship enough units. They might have converted production capacity for repair. This quarter is traditionally the peak load for returns, which lags peak holiday sales. They may have had supply chain problems of some type. Yield issues with the new CPU. Other quality issues, like a new high fail rate defect that limited how many they could make. Etc. "

As for larger HD's (hard drives), that was always the plan for later in the life cycle. But size was always TBD (to be determined). One consideration you didn't mention regarding the decision of BR (Blu-Ray) vs. downloaded content is streaming speed. I don't know about you guys, but I have BB (broadband) cable to my PC, and 802.1b/g wireless to my 360. It's pretty damn slow to get anything of size onto the 360. I can drive to the video store and back in less time than I could download an HD movie. That would seem to push them towards BR as the HD source for customer satisfaction.

But from MS's perspective, they want users to download content because that makes the money per view flow through them. Since they have only sold about 300k HD (HD-DVD) players so far, demand for add on drives isn't that high for 360. If they did a BR (Blu-Ray) add on, it would only be for customer satisfaction. They probably wouldn't ever do a built-in for that same reason, not enough demand. Even if they did, at that level of demand, it shouldn't hurt their download revenues if they can fix the slow load problems. They are staffing up in that area right now, so you never know.

It's the download revenues they really want, plus the user standardization on the MS digital entertainment platform. It all works together, and supports MS's monopolies. That's why they can and will sink billions of dollars into Xbox, when they will never break even on that business unit. Because Xbox is a defensive product that protects and extends MS's reach into the home. So that by using the 360 as an entertainment hub, you are likely also a customer of Windows, Office and other very high profit margin products.

The internal distribution of reports in the xbox unit has been severely restricted since I started posting in Feb. That was predictable. There have also been emails from top management about "serious" concerns regarding leaks. So information has become a little harder to come by.

But not impossible. I've been told that the supply constraints are due to supply chain issues regarding the quality of ODDs (optical disc drive) and GPUs (graphics chips). It didn't help that no one in China works for 2 weeks during CNY (Chinese New Year).

And it's confirmed 100% that the HD (hard drive) is moving to 60g standard. Those configurations are in design verification testing right now. I'd bet that this changeover also contributed to the lack of units. When MS changes major sub-assemblies like this, they try not to over produce the old configurations.

So this is a case of poor planning, supply chain and quality issues restricting production. Not demand out stripping capacity (supply).

"It seems we have a failure to execute"

Posted by at March 17, 2008 1:14 a.m.
Category:
Comments
#108712

Posted by unregistered user at 3/17/08 8:13 a.m.

You must be a either a complete idiot or somebody who has never downloaded anything over Xbox Live. If you think you can drive to the video store faster than you can start watching a video on Xbox Live you must live next to the blockbuster. Movies and TV shows usualy begin playing within five minutes of starting the download.

#108716

Posted by 8bitjoystick at 3/17/08 8:51 a.m.

Well I do have a car and can drive to my local Hollywood video in about five minutes. I also have DSL and if I wanted to try to download another movie in HD it would take all night, cost me a bit and you only have a day from the first moment that you hit play. My DSL is nice but there is no way that I can stream HD video and downloading it will take over night. But it's all hypothecal since I have a few episodes of Robot Chicken and Southpark and an Xbox Original game take up all the spare space on my 20-Gig HD.

#108796

Posted by unregistered user at 3/17/08 12:40 p.m.

DSL, that explains it. True "broadband" is anything 10 Mbps or more. That's what I have. Once you get into the 1 MB/sec download speed, anything is possible. The future is downloading, DRM or not. A movie in 10-15 minutes? I'll buy that.

It's also interesting to note that although MS is not breaking even on Xbox...they are making money. The momentum is there. Why is this blog always so biased?

#108797

Posted by 8bitjoystick at 3/17/08 12:46 p.m.

Oh don't give me the whole DSL is not real broadband BS. That is like saying that only 1080p is "TRUE HD" and 1080i does not "count".

Microsoft is not selling movies.. they are renting them for 24 hour periods. I don't think the future of movies is that they are going to disappear after 24 hours.

They are making a profit if you look at the numbers in a right way but it will take a very long time for them to make up the start up cost of the Xbox team. You have to look at how they fit in the big picture of the company.

#108806

Posted by unregistered user at 3/17/08 1:11 p.m.

The advantage to owning a movie is instant access all of the time. If you can download any movie anytime I think it would be much more cost effective to pay 5-10 dollars per viewing versus buying a 40 dollar blue ray disc. That is assuming you get all of the special features with the download. Unless its something you know you are going to watch over and over and possibly let other people borrow.

#108814

Posted by 8bitjoystick at 3/17/08 1:24 p.m.

I have not seen any special features or commentary tracks in the movies that I rented via Xbox Live Marketplace.

#108877

Posted by unregistered user at 3/17/08 3:31 p.m.

Another problem with downloading movies and content is when it is on a proprietary system like the xbox360 and the damn thing burns up for the 3rd time in a year, you're screwed getting access to things you've already paid for unless you go buy another $250 console.
Or you can wait 30 days for your refurbed console from mexico.

#108879

Posted by unregistered user at 3/17/08 3:43 p.m.

Why can't M$ allow you to move TV shows you've paid for (especially applicable to a season of Lost)to a PC, eternal usb or thumb drive like apple TV does?

#109103

Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 9:21 a.m.

First off, only is this country do we tolerate 3 MB "broadband". 768 kbps broadband? Give me a break, no wonder why these online video services aren't selling consoles and devices. Go to other industrialized countries, and see what is meant by the term broadband.

Second, the future of movie downloads is an all-you-can-watch-for-a-monthly-fee model. Much like Netflix, only with downloads. Nobody is really there yet, but consoles like the 360 open a door to the possibility -- it's already connected to your TV, and that's what's needed as a start. MS knows this.

Regarding moving downloads to other devices...if your 360 is connected to your TV...why do you need to do that? Oh wait, you probably want to run it on your iPod or your cell phone. The content needs DRM. Apple lets you do that, sure...but only with their devices. Can you download a movie using AppleTV to a thumbdrive and plug that into a PC and transfer it to my cell phone? My guess would be 'no'.

Maybe, just maybe, instead of stating how MS is doing everything wrong, you contrast that with somebody who is actually doing those "wrong" things right? You know, how is Sony handling this movie thing...or Nintendo...compare and contrast...that's what writing is about. Journalism, explaining both sides...proving a point.

#109111

Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 10:04 a.m.

All I am saying is that before FiOS came along, residential broadband was anything cable/dsl. Speeds were irrelevant to the definition. As far as other countries speed, I have several friends who live in other industrial countries and complain about their speeds.

Netflix does a REALLy decent job streaming movies through their "Watch Instantly" feature. Decent resolution with no hiccups and minimal starting delays. If they could code this feature for the 360 OS, I think that would be the perfect scenario to attract new customers as well as increase use of the 360 "on-demand" service. Downloading a 30 minute show does take awhile, even in SD.

#109116

Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 10:14 a.m.

"Why can't M$ allow you to move TV shows you've paid for (especially applicable to a season of Lost)to a PC, eternal usb or thumb drive like apple TV does?"

The PS3 also allows you to download to a PC, external HDD or thumb drive. Why can't the XBOX 360? Because then MS can't sell you an overpriced proprietary device. Why allow you to save game to a $20 thumb drive that can hold 2 GB when they can sell you a 512 KB memory card for $50? Why allow you to swap out your HDD for a 160 GB laptop drive like the PS3 does for $100 when you can be forced to buy a 120 GB 360 HDD for $180?

What's ironic about all of it is that most computers use Windows yet you can't download anything to them from the 360. Yet the PS3 which is a SONY product you can.

#109122

Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 10:27 a.m.

"Posted by unregistered user at 3/17/08 12:40 p.m.

DSL, that explains it. True "broadband" is anything 10 Mbps or more. "

Perhaps you fail to realize that 90% of Americans with internet access can't even get 10 Mbps and less than 5% of all Americans that have internet access have this speed or higher. Downloads are the future maybe in 2020. When 50% of American either don't have internet or have dial up and half of the other 50% have 2 Mbps or less, downloads are still a FAR ways away. No to mention XBL has a whopping 300 movies both regular and HD combined.

Even at 10 Mbps it would take 1 hour and 20 minutes to download a HD movie.

Also XBL downloads are RENTALS some people still would like to OWN a movie. So blu-ray isn't going away anytime soon. Also BLX HD movies barely qualify as HD.
first of all they are 720p compared to 1080 for blu-ray. Secondly they have a bitrate of only 6 Mbps compared to 40 Mbps for blu-ray. Heck regular DVD has bitrate of 8 Mbps. So to say that a XBL 720p 6 Mbps bitrate "HD" download is the same thing as a 1080p 40 Mbps bitrate blu-ray movie is idiocy.

No to mention the fact that ISPs are now seriously considering having caps. And those caps maybe be as low as 20 GB a month.

#109134

Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 11:01 a.m.

I understand that people may want to OWN a movie, but what percentage? You need to understand the statistics and the marketing related to that. I just want to casually download a movie, watch it, and throw it away. That's what I do with Netflix. In fact, 95% of the media I consume...I don't want to keep. How many people are like me? Probably a lot, considering how many people subscribe to Netflix and rent movies through other retail channels.

Also, for casual viewing...quality may not matter. For some, it does. But not everybody. I only purchase movies for my daughter, and she doesn't give two thoughts to quality.

Mentioning problems about ISPs -- from speeds to download caps -- means nothing to MS. I believe that, based on marketing research, MS provides a decent download model that is acceptable to the majority of their customers.

#109180

Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 1:24 p.m.

I suggest that the reason the HD-DVD add-on was not that popular was because it was a gamble. Now that Blu-Ray has won the 'war', I'm hanging out for a 360 Blu-Ray add-on.

If Microsoft doesn't come out with one soon, I shall sell up and buy a PS3.

Digital downloads are great if bandwidth allows, but I think it is all to premature.

#109418

Posted by unregistered user at 3/19/08 2:05 a.m.

==Posted by unregistered user at 3/18/08 9:21 a.m.

===First off, only is this country do we tolerate 3 MB "broadband". 768 kbps broadband? Give me a break, no wonder why these online video services aren't selling consoles and devices. Go to other industrialized countries, and see what is meant by the term broadband.

Ah, a praiser of powerless European nations.

If the US was as tiny and unimportant as denmark, I'm sure our broadband would be 100mbs too.

They need it to read about us. Those who cannot do, watch.

#109569

Posted by 8bitjoystick at 3/19/08 12:00 p.m.

Denmark actually has a pretty robust econemy
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Denmark

and is home to a couple game developers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Io_Interactive

The Hitmen game series are from Denmark. That and their tasty butter cookie tins.

#109697

Posted by unregistered user at 3/19/08 3:49 p.m.

As a fan of Xbox I find it extremely dissapointing that they didn't incorporate an HD-DVD player into the 360. Sales of HD-DVD's would most surely have surpassed those of Blu-ray had we seen this and Warner Bros. might've decided to drop Blu-ray instead.

Also, it is a moot point to argue the comparison of Blu-ray vs. XBL downloadable movies. Blu-ray is undeniably superior and I'm not particularly fond of paying more than $5 for a rental that I can only watch for 24 hours. If Microsoft could expand on their service by charging a monthly fee for unlimited downloads however, then maybe they would have a service worth talking about.

As it is now, MS is better for games and PS3 is undoubtedbly better for watching movies. Regular DVD upscaling (that looks fantastic) and a Blu-ray player are great features to have in a video game console at a price that is comparable to the cheapest Blu-ray players on the market.

Microsoft seems to think that movies are not important in considering the sales of gaming consoles, but I know that they are horribly mistaken. I know several people that have bought a PS3 predominantly for the Blu-ray player and if they don't do something within the next year I might have to do the same.

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