Posted by Cameron King at 7/23/08 2:27 p.m.

The way Washburn has been pitching lately, he is our number 2 starter behind Felix. maybe we should hang on to him. As far as Viedro is concerned, if they will take him, give him to them. Find some rookie league guy to make it a legal trade, and get rid of him. A .215 DH is absurd.

Posted by ballardist at 7/23/08 2:34 p.m.

"As far as Viedro (sic) is concerned, if they will take him, give him to them. ... A .215 DH is absurd."

And yet, the Yankees seem to want one - maybe as a stable pony for Richie?

Posted by Notagreener at 7/23/08 2:49 p.m.

Nope, I say if you can find a good deal for Wash, let him go. He may be our #2 pitcher right now, but how long will that last? Remember Jeff Weaver last year? He was virtually unstoppable for several starts, bookended by some really lousy starts. I remember earlier this year, there were some analysts who said that Washburn doesn't have an "out" pitch...he'd get ahead in the count and couldn't put anyone away. Did he start to figure out how to finish guys off, or is this a passing phase of good luck for him?

Posted by dinolee at 7/23/08 3:02 p.m.

it's a phase. trade him now while he has some value.
get out from his horrible contract. i'd rather have rowland-smith starting for the league minimum. plus, before he got hurt in tacoma, feirabend was pitching well, too. he will be back real soon.
heck, if anybody would take batista off our hands too, i'd do it.
silva, on the other hand... we are stuck with for eternity, or at least 3 more years.

Posted by dcp at 7/23/08 3:04 p.m.

Hows this for a deal... We give them Washburn if they agree to take Johjima and Vidro?

Posted by J.P. Patches Pal at 7/23/08 3:22 p.m.

No, let's not hang on to any of these putzes. Blow up the entire team and start over. It can't get any worse...

Posted by dinolee at 7/23/08 3:26 p.m.

next years starters: hernandez bedard morrow rowland-smith and silva.
but we need hitters more than anything. we suck at the plate. it's embarassing to watch.

Posted by MikaVexo at 7/23/08 3:26 p.m.

Ummm, doesn't Kei Igawa suck more than any of our current pitchers?

Posted by idontcare at 7/23/08 3:36 p.m.

Posted by MikaVexo at 7/23/08 3:26 p.m.

Ummm, doesn't Kei Igawa suck more than any of our current pitchers?

But he's cheaper and we get rid of Vidro. I would pay to get rid of Vidro...

Posted by kiowaman at 7/23/08 3:51 p.m.

well, that makes sense! Okay we get rid of two players we could do without, although Vidor actually did something right by hitting one out to tie the game, but are the M's going to continue to be the team that acts like the punk he gets bullied by the big bad teams into taking whatever they want to give or are they going to start hitting back? By that I mean the Yankess want to send a pitcher in a trade to us that they have not been happy with since he has been with them, meaning he is not that good. No, the M's need to tell the Yanks to stuff it and if they want our two players then give up someone that will actually be ready to help us now not someday down the road, if that happens. Frankly, they should just eat the season now and not trade anyone until they get an actual GM in charge who will be here for awhile. If they make deals now they will be in the same shape as Bavasi left the current interim,..with a bunch of high priced crap like Kenji.There are supposedly some people out there with other teams that are not GM's but assistant GM's who are ready to make the move to the top and apparently according to many in the league are ready and rarin to go with talent. So just wait.

Posted by _badger at 7/23/08 4:51 p.m.

I like Wash... Keep him.

Posted by cewl20 at 7/23/08 5:26 p.m.

If Vidro goes, do the deal. Washburn is 33, and Rowland-Smith is legit for a lefty and should easily move into the rotation once Washburn is gone. There is a loser mentality on this team and a good chunk of the players on this team need to go.

Posted by sullyinfla at 7/23/08 5:27 p.m.

Washburn is the only player in the deal with a major league future... release Vidro, pick up Igawa after he's released if you want him.

Posted by M's Defender at 7/23/08 6:03 p.m.

If the NYYs want Washburn AND Vidro and if they give Igawa and say a prospect like Kennedy if we throw in say a 2 mil cash consideration or Johjima DO THE DEAL.
Clears salary room for next season to do extensions on say Hernandez maybe pickup a couple 1 yr filler FAs til a kid in AAA is ready.
Adds to the MiLB talent available to the parent club to fill bench and starter needs etc.........
By making these moves THIS deadline instead of the offseson is with the present situation of high losses few wins it's a low risk time to clear space for the AAA level talent to evaluate those who just maybe MLB ready under real game conditions.
Not just in the Sept callup when rosters expand to 40 man and in ST.

Posted by dover5005 at 7/23/08 6:12 p.m.

i am find with any deal that goes down i just want some one from the NY farm system to come are way

like
Alberto Gonzalez ss
Matt Carson of
Gregory Porter of
http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?t=t_ros&cid=531&stn=true&sid=t531

kei igawa
http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/milb/stats/stats.jsp?n=Kei%20Igawa&pos=P&sid=t531&t=p_pbp&pid=506432

Posted by JJDJ at 7/23/08 6:43 p.m.

Get rid of Wash and get something for him. Washburn is just pitching well because he knows he's trade bait, and the better he pitches, the more likely he'll go to a real contender.

Posted by brian199511 at 7/23/08 6:47 p.m.

Washburn has not been anything but a bottom of the rotation pitcher the last three years. A short stint of decent pitching doesn't change that fact. Vidro is mediocre and Igawa a tragedy. The Yankees can keep Igawa or dump him. Get a couple of prospects for Washburn and move on. Maybe NY will take Lincoln and Armstrong as beer vendors in their new stadium.

Posted by dover5005 at 7/23/08 6:54 p.m.

m's moves to make

wash - vidro to yanks for igawa and some kind of prospect
RRS or igawa put into the rotation
play willie more and bring up sunders

trade raul for prospects from the DBacks
bring up wlad to play lf

trade rhodes to a contender to add a healthy lefty vet to a bullpen and get back a prospect

drop burke and bring up rob johnson
drop cairo bring up tug

if ya get a prospect from the yanks, one for Rhodes, and 2 or 3 for raul you add 4 to 5 new players to the tacoma roster

team
c
kenji
clement
johnson
if
1b lahair
2nd lopez tug
ss uni
3rd beltre
of
rf ichiro
cf reed
lf wlad
sunders

anywhere
bloomquist

could bring up Craig Wilson ( is doing well since being in tacoma)to back up lahair instead of bringing mike sunders or rob johnson up if ya don't johnson or kenji might have to learn how to play 1B

13 postion players just like the current roster but with the youth gaining experience and those that are not in the m's plans are gone!

if i am GM thats what i do

Posted by thumbprint27 at 7/23/08 8:53 p.m.

Very quickly as I'm about to turn in for the evening! Keep Wash and ship Vidro on the next ship leaving the port! Maybe Vidro is an upgrade from Sexton for the Yanks. I notice that Sexton has learned how to walk, better than striking-out!

Posted by Skagitflats at 7/23/08 9:18 p.m.

Offer Jhojima and Vidro along with Washburn for prospects in the NY farm system. Not that sorry assed wanna be pitcher they are trying to dump on us. Our catcher simply sickens me to watch him try to call games and play the position. He is simply useless, and our DH has very sound warning track power. But we got Bedard........... This team needs a lot more help than we can get for Washburn and Vidro. They need front office management first.

Posted by orian at 7/23/08 11:20 p.m.

It was a stretch to put Saunders in AAA and he is struggling at that level. He needs to stay there and gain experience.

Posted by jafabian at 7/24/08 10:36 a.m.

I'd say everyone but Ichiro, Felix, JJ and Morrow are tradable.

I'd like to see the M's trade Wash and Vidro for some Yankee prospects. Maybe their 3B prospect, Bradley Suttle and an A pitcher like David Robertson? Something like that.

Posted by GoBigChoke at 7/24/08 10:59 a.m.

i agree with kiowaman- why should we take an expensive tragedy off the yankees? legit prospects are what we need now, not more crappy, expensive players.

Posted by porgy at 7/24/08 11:30 a.m.

Trade Vidro!!

How awful it was to watch yesterday when we have a chance to win a game yesterday in the bottom of the 9th, 10th and 11th and these are our hitters:

Betancourt: 3 HR all season
Johjima: 3 HR all season
Cairo: 0 HR since 2005
Bloomquist: 1 double, 0 HR all season

Suzuki: 4 HR
Lopez: 6 HR
Ibanez: no complaints

Vidro: 6 HR all season and 11 in 2 years as DH.
Beltre: no complaints
Bentancourt: see above
Johjima: see above

THIS TEAM CANNOT HIT.
Sports Illustrated predicted before the season that the Mariners would score the fewest runs in the AL. Everyone knew it...

I won't even begin talking about how horrible the clubhouse chemistry appears to be on this team. Wow.

Posted by TRAPPED IN ILLINOIS at 7/24/08 11:36 a.m.

Washburn for Igawa? Are you kidding me?! That would be just ANOTHER example of the M's tremendous lack of knowledge when it comes to evaluating/acquiring players. Igawa is TERRIBLE, he is WORSE than Vidro if that is at all possible. Why are they constantly looking to acquire somebody else's garbage? The Padres gave up LHP Randy Wolf {same quality as Washburn} and in return the Astros sent a 26 year old 6'6" RHP starter who was averaging apprx. 1 strikeout per inning at AA Round Rock. The M's front office really need to wake up. They obviously need to hire some BASEBALL people to run this Titanic disaster. If I were other teams looking for players, why would you look anywhere else when you clearly can give away your junk & acquire quality complimentary players like Beltre, Washburn, Putz, Ibanez to help during a pennant push? By the way, if anybody thinks that LaHair is the solution at 1b then they really need to wake up also. The Mariners have NO CLUE so dont expect any bright bold moves to happen anytime soon on the field or in the front office. SO SAD!

Posted by GarForever at 7/24/08 12:19 p.m.

If we agree to take Igawa back in exchange for Vidro, we have to get a legitimate piece in return: Washburn isn't as good as his last two months, but he isn't as bad as he was to start the season either. Furthermore, his resurgence is explainable: he talked to an old college coach who noticed a glitch in his delivery, and ever since then he's pitched much better. Therefore, I hope the FO won't trade a stiff for a stiff (Igawa for Vidro) and then throw in a legitimate, durable, innings-eating lefty for the privilege of doing business with the Yankees. Kennedy would be good, though I agree with Dover that the Yankees have some bats who could do some future damage. This team needs punch more than anything. Sounds like Wladdy has figured things out in AAA, and will be a much better big league hitter the next time around. But if there's no one in the lineup around him, so what?

Posted by jamesess at 7/24/08 4:18 p.m.

What are the M's getting with Rhodes going to the Marlins?

Posted by dover5005 at 7/24/08 6:53 p.m.

last week i heard on espn that the marlins really wanted to add to the bullpen and thought that they move thier 1st basemen Mike Jacobs

rhodes and lowe for Mike Jacobs

i would do it

Posted by dover5005 at 7/24/08 6:54 p.m.

"5:36pm: According to Ed Price of the Newark Star-Ledger, talks have progressed on a possible Washburn-Yankees trade. Price says the Ms aren't sold on Kei Igawa, but the Yankees are willing to discuss Melky Cabrera and Brett Gardner."

Posted by jamesess at 7/24/08 6:57 p.m.

And it sounds like the Yanks want Vidro OUT of the deal. They don't want him, the M's are insisting on a package deal so the Yankees will need time to set up antoher trade with another team to get rid of him.

Posted by jamesess at 7/24/08 6:59 p.m.

It is a stretch to imagine but Halliday wants out of Toronto and Bedard desperately wants into Toronto. I would try about everything to make that happen. I'm not exactly ready to give up on Bedard but if he could net a pitcher like that in return that would be great. It would take another 5 player trade though I'm sure so in the end the Bedard trade would cost the M's 8 players.

Posted by dover5005 at 7/24/08 9:49 p.m.

• Seattle's slew: It could be an action-packed week in Seattle. When we surveyed teams this week on players they expect to see moved, Jarrod Washburn was voted most likely starter to get traded and Arthur Rhodes was voted most likely left-handed set-up man to relocate. The Mariners are driving a slightly harder bargain on Raul Ibanez, but if they don't move him, too, it won't be for lack of interest.

Adrian Beltre

Beltre

• Yo Adrian: Despite reports that the Twins have given up on their attempts to pry Adrian Beltre away from Seattle, we're hearing those discussions are far from dead. The Twins' No. 1 trading priority is to upgrade at third base. One team that reportedly has packed it in on Beltre is the Dodgers, after they learned that Beltre's no-trade list specifically blocks his return to Chavez Ravine.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=stark_jayson&page=rumblings

Posted by Idaho M at 7/24/08 10:28 p.m.

No one ever mentions keeping Dickey around. I think the guy is capable of mid rotation stuff for the next 10 years with that knuckler. Seems to have a lot of commitment and a good attitude too.

Speaking of attitudes, I LIKE Bedard. I don't care if he talks to the media and I think he's just been hurt.

Posted by dover5005 at 7/24/08 10:56 p.m.

i think is a lil bee otch

there are some things you have to do when you make millions!

Posted by EdgarEstaCaliente at 7/25/08 12:30 a.m.

You mean someone WANTS Vidro...

Posted by dover5005 at 7/25/08 2:34 a.m.

wash vidro for melky and igawa
raul for prospects
rhodes and kenji for mike jacobs
DFA cairo burke and bautista
bring up wlad tug

c clement johnson
1b jacobs lahair
2b lopez tug
ss uni
3rd beltre
rf ichiro
cf melky reed
lf wlad
anywhere bloomquist

rotation
felix
bedard - trade whenever his stock is highest between now and next years trade deadline
sliva
dickey
rrs/igawa

bullpen
putz
marrow
lowe
green
jimenez
corcoran

this should be the roster next week!

then hire Kim Ng

Posted by jd928 at 7/25/08 7:22 a.m.

Make it a package deal. Take both or neither. Washburn does have market value while Vidro is worthless. Hope to get one decent prospect in return.

Posted by thumbprint27 at 7/25/08 8:06 a.m.

Dover 5005,

Interesting roster suggestions! I honestly believe that we need an upgrade at CF, obviously Reed and Bloomquist or not the answers! I would think that Coco Crisp would be an improvement, not great but would give us something better! I would be excited to get rid of Vidro and Cairo, they both are over-the-hill! Let's go younger than using over-the-hill guys! Another fall-out from Bavasi? I sincerely hope that the new GM and President take lessons from Billy Beane!

Posted by jamesess at 7/25/08 8:11 a.m.

Vidro is worth a lot more to a NL team. He is a switch hitter off the bench and reality for him is that at this point in his career that is what he is. He isn't a starter anymore and he doesn't drive in enough runs to make it as a full time DH. The Yankees don't want him. Putting him in the deal was Seattle's idea not New York's and that may very well be the deal breaker. I see Wash going to a NL club. Too bad the Brewers don't need another pitcher. They have some talent to trade and it is near Wash's home.
Vidro should be traded to the Dodger's for a lower level prospect. That will give Vidro a chance to catch on with another team and also not ding the 40 man roster.
The bad part about all of these suggested trades is that teams have to consider where they are going to put the guys they get in return or if they get less in return they still have to fill their minor league teams with acceptable talent.
It would be great to get MLB ready talent in return but how do we work the 40 man to get all these guy onto the roster? That is why a lot of trades net younger guys that don't have to be put on the 25 or 40 man roster for a while.

Posted by inter sounder at 7/25/08 9:41 a.m.

Yup, the only way the deal goes through if the Yankees insist on Agawa is for the M's to insist that Vidro be part of the deal. It doesn't make any sense to do a Washburn-Agawa only deal, the M's are trying to shed salary. Shipping out Vidro can make it more agreeable.

Posted by porgy at 7/25/08 10:21 a.m.

Here are some moves I'd like to see:

1) Trade Johjima for anything. Clement has 5 HRs in 117 ABs. With the same number of ABs as Betancourt (345), Clement would have 15 HR (second on the team).

What do the Mariners do? They bring guys up for one month and expect them to have an immediate and smooth transition.

What do the Orioles do? They give a guy like Adam Jones the option to play every day and he IMPROVES and adjusts to life as a MLB player.

2) Let's allow Clement, Balentien, and maybe even LaHair play EVERY DAY. There is no need to take baby steps with these players.

Trade Johjima.
Trade Vidro.
Sign some players with some pop in their bat and let them play.

Clement is a proven star at every level -- Let him play before they prematruely trade him like Adam Jones, Jason V., etc, etc.

Posted by dover5005 at 7/25/08 11:14 a.m.

porgy

i would also add rob johnson

what is the point of jaime burke he plays 1 a month if we got rid of jamie he could come up and play catcher every once in a while and let him dh some times

if kenji is dealt he must come up

look at my roster above thats what should happen!!!

Posted by porgy at 7/25/08 11:30 a.m.

Dover,
Good moves and good ideas.
I hope we keep Raul b/c I think he is too reliable to let go...probably the best signing we've made in 5 years.

Anyone else freaked out about our ability or perhaps inability to resign Felix if we keep losing??

Posted by dover5005 at 7/25/08 12:00 p.m.

raul's contract is up in the end of the season so if the m's wanted they could sign him back as a free agent while also getting prospects for him and letting him play for a contender

the m's will cross Felix's bridge when yeah get there

things just work out if ya win! they need to get better and younger

Posted by jamesess at 7/25/08 12:06 p.m.

If I recall correctly they would lose draft picks if they re-sign a player at the end of the season they trade him in. I could be way off there but I am pretty sure there is a penalty for something like that.
Reality is though that if they trade him they won't see him again until he comes to Safeco as an opponent. It is a lot easier to sign a guy you see every day than it is to wait for the end of the season after the team he is with has already made their pitch.
Unless they can find a better left handed option for DH, LF or 1B then they need to hang onto Raul.

Posted by dover5005 at 7/25/08 12:58 p.m.

i guess ya bank on the fact that he likes the m's and that he likes the area and doesn't want to move his family

Posted by jamesess at 7/25/08 1:27 p.m.

He doesn't live here in the offseason though does he? I thought his family lived in Florida.

Posted by M's Defender at 7/25/08 8:08 p.m.

This deal is most likely moot and of the table with the NYYs picking up Xady and Marte from the Pirates for 4 low level prospects.

Posted by jamesess at 7/26/08 9:15 a.m.

Actually I think that means that the deal is close. The Yankees are going to replace Melky, who will be traded to the M's and Marte is the left RP they have needed all year.
I don't think Igawa will be coming this way. I think that he was thrown in because the M's insisted Vidro be a trading piece. They don't want Vidro. Vidro will be a great piece on a NL team. He is geared that way and it will extend his career a few more seasons.
The dynamic of this team needs to change. They need some fire and they need a scrapper like they had in Guillen. They don't need to have a fire sale and they don't need to trade everyone to get their needs filled. I would definitely find a way to get Bradley from the Rangers. You hate to give Texas something they really need, strong starting pitching, but I would definitely explore a way to get him.